Remarks on CCCNY

As I have commented the negative of other churches. It is only fair for me to comment upon the one I'm attending.

Why
I attend CCCNY? The one humble reason is: The use of hymnals as the only
music media in worship. One can note that it is hard to find a chinese
church of this sort. It would appear that this is a suicide style in
today's churches.

Although many english traditional churches still
make use of classical hymnals, they either divide their services into a
"classical hymns" for old people group and a "hip music" for the younger generation (This only shows that their leaders should spend more time on
studying music and its theory, what music is.) or become self-confined
worshippers who could only admire the beauty of hymnals themselves and
not be able to share it (Someone needs to remind them that they are
wrong in thinking that the commission of Jesus Christ is not for them).

Now, back to the central topic. After I have mentioned the good part, here comes the bad ones.

I am not comparing this church to any other. But my discernment is based on what is expected of the church and its leaders.

First
off, this is a reformed church, and one whose many leaders and elders
are well acquainted with  Dr. Tong's ministry as well as Dr. Tong
himself in person.

What I can see is, as much as these have
listened to Dr. Tong's lectures, seminar, sermons, etc. they are more of admirers and "high class" friendship seekers than true students of
the word of God. Yes, I do see some effect, for Dr. Stephen Tong is
truly God's servant and therefore his sermons have some "side" (in a
good way) effects on these people. I used "side effect" even though I
put it in a positive sense because I do not think this is what these
people are aftering themselves. Just like if I keep repeating "for God
so love the world..." in my class, all my students would be able to
quote John 3:16 by heart but they may not be aware of it or its meaning.
Sometimes it is the teacher who is the problem, but not in this case.
What's the obstacle then? It's their pride for thinking that their
relationship with Dr. Tong is special enough to not care about seeking
after the Kingdom of God.

Therefore problems exist. For example,
Pastor Laura Lin consistently has issues with elder Lyna Lim in some
very general things. As for Lyna, frequently tempted by the realm of the
pentecostal excitement.

Thus this will be in my prayer.

Secondly,
is the incompetence of organization. Doing a lot of useless things just
because "Oh I'm afraid it would be too much work for you" kind of
notion. Pastor Laura Lin once (well more than once) asked me if I needed
some help when I was assigned a certain task which I have agreed to
weeks ago and awaiting for her confirmation to proceed to certain stage,
my more direct response was: There’s no such thing as too much work
or too little work in God’s kingdom. Only willing and wise servants and
the rest as principled from Gideon’s 300 soldiers.

Why did I
respond this way? Because she uses not biblical teachings in choosing
co-workers. This is something even non-christians knew. It's as if when
one becomes a Christian, one becomes dumber. When we pick people to work
with us, we do not pick them just because they are "part of" our
membership. We pick them because we know they have the willingness for this and we see the right qualification in them for certain tasks and we pick them for that particular tasks.
Unfortunately, Laura is either ignorant of such fact and expects God to
"fix it all" Himself or she really just haven't advanced to this part of
life lesson yet. It is pathetic to think those who are single should
serve more and those who have married and have children should serve
less. Never have I read such kind of verse in scripture. Perhaps she did
it this way to make families comfortable enough to want to stay and not
leave while the "singles" are disposable unless they have "higher
class" friendship status.

The other major issue is regarding
music books for the choir for STEMI rally. I voiced that it is important
that every members should buy their own music (after all it's only
around $12-$15 dollars and we're not living in Siberia) instead of "free
will offering" or sponsorship by STEMI. Something pastor Lin realized
too late, while Lyna pretended she agreed with me in the beginning. Why
would they not listen? My only guess is that they are holding onto the
fundamental failure of Ameristians: See I am so nice to you so you must
be nice back to me otherwise God will praise me anyway for the unpaid
niceness (A misunderstanding of Luke 6:31 while ignoring 1Peter 2:20).

I
wouldn't be surprised if Laura or Lyna praise Uzzah for what he did and
condemn David or the others for not "helping out" Uzzah or warning him
about not to touch the Ark. It is always amazing how those who interpret
the word this way always "forget" to blame God Himself for striking the
"wrong" guy. Perhaps they would like to assume that Uzzah somehow has a
dirtier heart than they themselves to begin with which is just way off
the topic of the passage.

Thirdly, is the incompetence of
education. This is my most struggle. It is so obvious that they lack so
much in this area that they'd rather find some scapegoat like me than
polishing and improving themselves. They have the blessings and benefit
of this country while Uncle Sam is abusing and manipulating material
resources for selfish gain, they have attended Stephen Tong's seminaries more than I (which I wonder what they had been doing all those times), yet they still need to rely on outsiders.
This shows laziness, unwilllingness to seek after God, and hypocrisy if
they deny the above. Thus a new form of Pharisees who obviously need the
kind of rebuking my Lord has given 2,000 years ago. If God calls not me
for such task, I pray for him whom God calls.

The leadership at this church sees no authority in God as teacher (though I see a few members in the congregation are not so).

Fourthly, now I'm being commanded to be the youth's counsellor in the summer retreat. I should do all my best as my Lord has told me in Matthew 23. But I must watch out for these foxes. I have put much entries on this subject, so I should here only repeat one of my statements: American Christians are expert at wasting people's time and money and energy. Why couldn't they plan (they were given the opportunity for at least a year) and train and prepare those who are willing and capable to attend their stupid retreat so that it will be "not so stupid"? Instead of asking me? Are they really that impotent? Not only will I do my best and rely totally on God's grace and away from their hypocritical praises, I should not take their ride (Good thing there's a train to that place - otherwise I'd rather take a $200 taxi) lest I owe them anything. There can be no packs between men and dogs. May God grant me this scepter.

Last but not least, is the celibacy of Lyna as well as Laura. Which I really do not think has anything to do with God's calling to celibacy. For Lyna perhaps it's similar to a Suzanne of Flushing Faith Bible church's situation, where she's too full of herself no men want to touch her. As for Laura, I do not know, it would seem like she was either born impotent or abused or suffered other similar family problem when she was younger, but apparently God's grace has covered her thus far, for the better of this church in this pathetic nation. Whatever it is, unless it was the case of "born an eunuch", it is unlikely God's call to a celibate life for it seems to have to do with selfish preferences than a sacrificial mean for the Kingdom of Heaven.

In
order to show them the path and teach them with whatever authorithy I
have now, I have to make sure I do not mix up with them, despite all the
tasks they want me to obey.

So help me God, that in my abiding
by their and pastor Laura Lin (林美雲)'s authority and praying for them, I
am guided solely by Thee and I do not follow them, their ways, for
blessed is he who walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor
standeth in the way of sinners.

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14 Responses to Remarks on CCCNY

  1. tim says:

    Therefore, CCCNY is a selfish church.
    The pastor loves to use "introducing" people she likes to friends of hers in high places to ensure special relationship.

    She does not truly care about the surrounding churches unless they provide her any benefit. You give me then I give you: The American way. When she tries to "sacrifice", she wastes unnecessary resources, there is no wisdom in her, for there had not been fear of God found in her.

  2. Tim says:

    I once thought pastor 林美雲 was the same one I heard Dr. Tong mentioned in Seminary in 2004. I supposed I was wrong, since I had discovered that there's also another 林美雲 from Thailand.

    I actually heard Dr. Tong mentioned this 林美雲 was from Thailand, but when I told Lyna of my memory, she just seemed to play dumb, as if she was unaware of another 林美雲.

    I made the mistake of thinking they are the same one. Because that one was humble, asking Dr. Tong question regarding problem with baptized infants not fulfilling their righteous path.

    This one, however, besides the nationality difference, is more on the aristocratic side of relationships. They both would have very opposite personalities. One seems to humble herself, the other constantly think about securing friends in high places and praising Bill Gothard's method of "say only good things"

  3. Tim says:

    Now this is the second time, I have been commanded by the church to go serve in the Retreat.

    Obviously, I believe this violate the right of a human being. What then? If the selfish & barren couldn't prosper without submission to God and beg God for their own growth, they naturally seek to violate the rights of others. Using flattery for others as an excuse for their own impotence.

    This is exactly why Jesus said in Matthew 23:3 "...but do not ye after their works..."

    Thus, I will yet again, do my best to the fullest: Astronomy Part II and the "excuse" of the pastor - Youth Speaker's Assistance.

    Last time, the lesson I gave the pastor was my withdrawal from their prayer meeting. This time, is the beginning of non-association, so I can keep myself right with God, that I will not be like them in any circumstances. Starting from making it clear to her for the first time, that I will not share any transportation with them nor take any financial compensation. Since I do not associate myself with them. (I am also considering, beginning next year, not taking the $100/mo tech support which she's paid til this December - while still keep doing the work if told to).

    So help me God!

  4. Tim says:

    I pray only that she does not follow the path of King Saul.

  5. Tim says:

    Finally defeated an Ameristian. It is just unfortunate that it has to be Rev Laura Lin.

    Special remark here to be used but yet (depending on opportunity):
    "Using the word pleasure is not acceptable"
    Ans: Please read 2Corinthians 12:10 (KJV) 100 times.

    "Suggestion denied is too strong" Denied is only used for inquiry, etc.
    Ans: Jesus said, let your yes be yes and no, no.

    Final blow:
    Now Twist not scripture lest ye be of the devil!

    Now, I am armed and ready. But I am giving a mercy seat.

  6. Tim says:

    Not the first, nor the second. Though I'm happy to translate, what is disturbing is that Rev. Lin probably think this is her excuse to 'train' me or whatever as a cover for her English deficiency. More over, it would also seem that she thinks she could 'compensate' this with either indirect monetary means or flattering praises as if for my future 'recommendation'.

    So the real disturbing part is I can't really disprove any of these lame presumptions of hers and I really don't care if 'it's the heart that counts' or not. Because ulterior motive and flattery are always sins that usually work hand in hand.

    So my lesson here is patience, if not wisdom.

  7. tim says:

    Her theology is what I personally called "Chameleon" theology.

    She tries to put sheep wool onto goats.

  8. tim says:

    Tante Elder Lyna is evangelical but not reformed; Rev. Laura Lin is reformed but not evangelical.

    Such is the symphony of my beloved church.

  9. tim says:

    兩個大問題,一個小問題。
    大問題,從歸正福音運動來看:
    1. 林美雲牧師是歸正的,但心裡不是福音運動的。
    2. 林望瑞長老是福音運動的,但心裡不是歸正的。

    小問題:
    教會基本上只有這以上二人的負擔,可惜她們不能相處。

  10. Tim says:

    CCCNY doesn't care about cultivation, but only admiration and recognition.

  11. kct says:

    Hi, recently I'm attending CCCNY and going to join them, but I just found your articles online regarding this church. Will there be anything I need to be aware of after I join them? Thank you.

    • timlyg says:

      Thank you for writing, kct. I didn't expect my online journal would be visited by people attending CCCNY.

      My articles on this journal is similar to a diary. They have no intention to guide or teach anyone like most blogs online, even though they may contain those elements. My advice for you is to keep attending, armed with the knowledge you have from my page here. If what I wrote helps, it should save you a lot of trouble when fellowshipping with fellow believers there. If it doesn't help, you are at no lost.

      What I write here mainly helps you to know me better, for good or bad. Hopefully for good. As for CCCNY, you will have to live through it yourself. Nevertheless, I would not advice you to stop attending CCCNY simply because of my article, or if I stop going. If there are churches not worth going, it is unlikely I would even mention them in my journal. CCCNY still has some good programs, I'd advice you to join the adult Sunday School: Dr. Tong's Romans Series Videos which has Chinese subtitle. You won't find this subtitle version anywhere else, even some Chinese speakers find the subtitle very helpful, due to Dr. Tong's accent and use of certain terminology/idoms. CCCNY's guest speakers are often well chosen, I'm sure you would benefit much from attending those workshops as well, and do go discuss with them after their talk.

      Hope this helps.

      • timlyg says:

        oh btw, for some minor pointers:
        If Elder Lyna asks you to do something and you do not want to, you can insist on "No", it may be tough, but if you have good reason (for me often times it is "it's a waste of my time if you don't care about the quality"), don't feel bad about saying "no"; Rev. Lin on the other hand, would usually respect your answer right away.

  12. timlyg says:

    You raise good people, you don't look for good people. Something she has never gotten.

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